Miguel Sanchez: 0:01

Hello everyone. Thank you for joining today's episode of the First Gen 1 0 1 podcast. Today we have Cesar. Margarito with us. Cesar. Thank you for being here today.

Cesar: 0:13

A pleasure to be here. Thank you for having me.

Miguel Sanchez: 0:15

you are a first generation graduate. But you're also very passionate about helping first generation students, and so I'm looking forward to this conversation. And before we go into your background, Tell us about Fly Socks and how are you helping first generation students that way?

Cesar: 0:32

So fly socks is the little venture I started in 2019, right before COVID, unfortunately. The idea behind that was to utilize the proceeds to provide scholarships for gen first gen students. It was right around that time, like other. Companies that had a philanthropic or social responsibility focus or emphasis were coming up, right? So I figured what if we did something like that? Most people wear socks, right? I had just moved to LA a couple years before that, and here, people are a little bit more trendy than where I came from. And I was getting into like colorful socks and those kinds of things. So I'm like, let me Look at this. Why not? So that's where the idea originated and why the colorful socks and example various samples and things of that. But more than anything it was just a way for me to find another option to help students like myself, right? They were first generation students.

Miguel Sanchez: 1:25

That is a great way to help first generation students. So for those of you who are listening or watching, make sure that you check that out. But let's go back and tell us about your background. What was it like growing up as a first generation student?

Cesar: 1:40

I think one of the identities you have to add to that is immigrant. So I'm originally from Jalisco, Mexico, a small, little tiny town outside of Guadalajara. And my parents were migrant field workers. So when my sibling, before I was born, when my siblings were older they were doing the back and forth Cape, they were in California for part of the year. See, the crop would be over, then they'd go to Mexico and then, back and forth. But when I was around 10 years old, they decided to make the permanent move without telling us that, we're gonna be moving to the States. So at 10 years old, fifth grade, towards the end of fifth grade that was my first experience with the US Education system in a little town in central California, Monterey County called Cholar. Really tiny town. When I was growing up, it was about 500 people. Now it's a metropolis. It's about 1500 people. Like New York, right?

Miguel Sanchez: 2:28

Yes so I recall just, from, we were talking about similarities when, before we started the episode and I mentioned I'm from Mexico City and very much we were kinda just told that we were going to be moving and one day I was in Mexico City and the next day I was in Rockland County, which happens to also be a small town in New York. Many people wanna say. New York thing, New York City, but I'm actually

Cesar: 2:53

Yeah.

Miguel Sanchez: 2:53

in north or up in the suburbs so you're starting in the US educational system and. You mentioned it was a small town. How was the process of getting accustomed to the new culture Were you working while you were gonna school? Because I know that tends to be some of the experiences for a lot of students who grew up in California

Cesar: 3:14

Yeah. Fortunately at that age I was not, I did have a lot of friends that became friends who did have to go work on the weekends or during the summers. It wasn't until high school, that was my first experience, like working in the fields. But during elementary, it was more the transition of. Acclimating to a new country, new language, all those different things. But my little sister and I, she's three years younger than I I was the default babysitter, so maybe that's why I didn't, I think I had to work. But yeah, so it was that transition. I think more than anything, it was the language. One of the good things about that area if you're not familiar it's a predominantly Latino community. 99% of the Latinos are Mexican for the most part. Very few African American or white students in, in that community. So in terms

Miguel Sanchez: 4:00

Making

Cesar: 4:01

that transition from an ethnic, from a racial standpoint, it wasn't all that different. It was just the language. And then seeing students that looked like me, but some of'em didn't speak Spanish, and that was a little confusing to me'cause I had never seen, brown skin, black hair, and had hair back then. Boys and girls not being able to speak Spanish, right? So it was that transition and I'm very fortunate and grateful for the students, the friends that I made they took me under the wing, taught me the language, taught me the customs and took me in, as early as fifth and sixth grade, and just snowball from there.

Miguel Sanchez: 4:33

you mentioned language being one of the primary challenges. So I remember when I was going to college and I never told my mother that I was going to college because she just didn't know what to do. Like she always wanted to help and she was always very, she worked very hard for my brother and I, and, we also grew up also in a very small town, like I mentioned, the idea of going to college was very foreign to her. And so in your family, how did that conversation start? Was there a point where in your high school years you were like, okay, I'm going to college because of these reasons. Was it more like your parents push you that way? How did that decision to go to college happen for you?

Cesar: 5:17

It wasn't really much of a choice, it was just known. And that's the reason my parents so there's four siblings in our family. My little sister and I are the two youngest, and I have an older sister and brother. So when we first made that move, the family was split. So it was the younger siblings that came with the parents to get a feel, get situated, all of those things. And about a year or two years later, then my older siblings came over. And the reason we all migrated, my parents made that decision was exactly because of education. So they knew that education was the only ticket outta poverty. And when you're poor and you're around other poor students, you don't know you're poor. You have roof over your head, food on your table, nothing fancy, simple frijoles and tortillas, kind of thing. You have everything that you need, right? So we didn't know that. But that was something that was instilled from very early age that you're going to school. When you're going to college. They couldn't articulate it. They couldn't tell you, okay, this is the path. First, you're gonna get an aa, then a bs, or ma, all that stuff. But they just knew that you were going to school, you were gonna college.

Miguel Sanchez: 6:21

Now

Cesar: 6:21

would just engrain me in all of us at the very young age. So when my older siblings came, they were too old for high school, so they actually enrolled in the community college. So they were actually the pioneers in terms of higher education. And because of that, like a lot of minority communities, we're very what's the word? It's escaping me right now, but because so and so did it that you're gonna go do it as well, right? So because my siblings went definitely the role model. But because we went there, it wasn't just gonna, you're gonna go to college, you're gonna go to that college

Miguel Sanchez: 6:54

I see.

Cesar: 6:54

But but I knew that I was gonna go to community college first, right? That was my first entry. And then I didn't know what I was gonna study, what to do or anything like that. I knew that's where I was going. That thought was always there. I was a so student. I had the brains for it, but I was a little bit more mischievous. Once I got acclimated language, all those different things, right? I can, express myself and not always in a positive or constructive way. But I got through junior high. I got through high school, fortunately. And because I was gonna go to a community college, I Ignored, some of the outreach services that our local four years provided. To go to a four year institution. I wasn't aware about the attrition rates at community colleges. All those things that, hear about. And I didn't really care at the point. I'm like, my siblings went there, it was good enough for them, I'm gonna go there. But it was the idea that we're always going to, gonna go to school was ingrained from a very young age. It's just they couldn't articulate the path or how. Go about it. So we kinda had to learn on our own.

Miguel Sanchez: 7:58

I was actually the first one who went a community college. And I am a

Cesar: 8:02

Yeah.

Miguel Sanchez: 8:02

big supporter of community colleges, especially for people like us who, going into college we may not know why we're going college. We know that's what we should be doing. in your case, you go into community college with a career path in mind? you say to yourself, oh, I wanna be a lawyer, I wanna be a doctor. What did that look like for you?

Cesar: 8:23

TV has always had a big influence. And does that thing be, that's why from an early age, once we moved, I dunno if you remember the TV series chips?

Miguel Sanchez: 8:33

of course.

Cesar: 8:34

Yes. Yeah. So I wanted to be a highway patrol, right? So through high school, that was my idea like. I'm gonna get outta high school and then yeah, go to college. But I wanna be a highway patrol officer. So that plan was there throughout all of high school. And even my first year at community college, I think I still had that idea. But by that time, my older sister had, transferred, finished school. She went to uc, Santa Cruz and she became a teacher. So then again, this whole concept of education, the importance of it it steered me in that way. I'm like, okay, let maybe I could be a teacher, right? And then once I started taking classes at community college, like history classes, I really had really good instructors. I'm like, Hey, this is cool. Like maybe I can do this. So then it went from highway patrol to history teacher. Like a high school history teacher. So while I was at community college, that was the plan. And even after I transferred, that was still my idea that I wanted to be a teacher. So I pivoted a little bit. But once I transferred that, that was a very different experience. Being away from home for the first time, being in a primarily white community. In my classes, I was a history major. In a room of 30, there might have been maybe two or three people of color. So all of those different things, it, the culture shock that I went through really impacted my academics. So I found myself going back home pretty much every week. And at that time I had a girlfriend, so it was also because I had a girlfriend, right? But academically I just struggle a lot. And like I said, even though my parents emphasized education, they didn't have the tools to help us navigate the process, especially the hidden curriculum, that we talk about. So when they would ask me, oh how are classes? How, how are you doing? I could just brush it off. I, oh, I'm fine. And nevermind. I just got a letter saying I was on academic probation, for the second or third time. But as long as I told'em I was fine, they took it at my word, right?

Miguel Sanchez: 10:36

So this is, you hit on the nail of the purpose of this podcast is to show those examples

Cesar: 10:42

Yeah.

Miguel Sanchez: 10:43

was it like. The choice to go to the community college, did you transfer to your four year institution because sister was doing it, or did you have more of a conscious decision of where you were gonna transfer?

Cesar: 10:57

I chose the institution that I went to because my brother went there.

Miguel Sanchez: 11:01

Okay.

Cesar: 11:02

So he went to a different school Cal Poly San Luis Obispo. And then when we were getting, we, I met my community college friends were in the application process. I heard some of them talking about oh, I'm gonna go to Cal Poly. I'm like, oh, I'll apply there too. I'll, check off the box. So it, there was really no intentionality. I was still just layering out there. But The name recognition my brother went there, my friends are going there. Okay, let me see if I can go there too. So I only applied to three universities all in state in California. Two of'em I thought I could be a on their soccer team. I played soccer at community college and that was my carrot to stay in school and do just do do well enough to be eligible to play. So that's what I thought. And, the other two institutions that I applied to, I also got in. So I got into all three institutions, but I chose San Luis Obispo because of my friends. My brother had gone there. I had no idea what that campus was like. And looking back, this is I shared with other folks is that even though my brother went there and he knew, I think he knew that I was gonna go there, we never talked, we never had that conversation for him to prepare me saying, this is the culture shock you're gonna see. This is how it's gonna be on day one. And actually the. First day I ever stepped on that campus, Wasn't the day to help him move out and go back home once he graduated. So we didn't, we weren't there at the same time. But I didn't really have a plan other than just, thinking about it in that linear that, okay, I'm gonna community college, then I'm gonna go to a four year and then I'm gonna get a job. And at that time I was still thinking, I'm gonna be a teacher, so I'm gonna be a history teacher, so I'm gonna major in history.

Miguel Sanchez: 12:41

was there someone in your college that helped you the college experience?

Cesar: 12:49

It took a while. So I consider myself a bit of a professional student. I was at my community college. I was there for three years, and then once I transferred, it took me another four years to get my bachelor's. And as I mentioned earlier, when I first transferred, I had a girlfriend back home, so I was going home every weekend. So I never had the forethought of I need to build community here.'cause come Friday afternoon I'm on the road and hour back home is an hour and a half and I need to be there'cause we got plans Friday night and then Monday morning I come back to campus and I do it all over again. And it wasn't until we broke up unfortunately that really, that forced me to not go home anymore. Then stay on campus, stay in the town, try to find community initially. One of the guys that I transferred with, he ended up becoming best friends. We were roommates together, and some of our friends who had went, had gone straight from high school to that college were our neighbors. So initially that was my initial hub, of friends and then through them, met other people and that, that was always safe. Because he has somebody else to make that introduction, make that connection. I think the first experience is one of the scariest ones in my life. I joined this student club. I grew up very timid, very shy kid, but I always wanted to dance. Traditional folklorico. I thought it was so cool growing up and everything, but I just didn't have the courage. The university had a group, still has the group. So I found out when they practice and where, and all those none of my other friends were into that. So I, that was the one of the first I did by myself. And and that group was so welcoming That really is what changed my experience because all of a sudden my community grew exponentially

Miguel Sanchez: 14:37

it

Cesar: 14:37

it wasn't just, the four or five friends from back home that were my neighbors now is these guys from all over the state. Different majors all these different things. And that's really what helped me in terms of socially adjust to the university. The academics is a whole other thing. But again, I struggled through it. And one of the things that later on I found out, is that. And I'm sure you see this too, students oftentimes put up a front right when they're going through it.'cause they don't want anybody else to know that they're not doing well, that there's something wrong, that they need help. And that's what I found out till afterwards. Like I said, my, my best friend later on and he was in the room right next to me. I found out he was on academic probation. I'm like, dude, I've been on academic probation. Let me walk you through this. But again, it was one of those things that you wanna save face, right? Or for whatever reason you do it that oftentimes you don't make yourself vulnerable enough to ask for question, ask questions, ask for help. But it wasn't, not that I connected with those other folks

Miguel Sanchez: 15:34

with

Cesar: 15:34

that I really felt like I had that sense of community. At the university to help me get through it and help overcome a little bit more of those adjustments especially with the culture shock.

Miguel Sanchez: 15:47

I also struggled academically in the beginning. And for me looking back had I asked the professor or. Academic support services. And I think I didn't do all these things because I just lacked confidence. as you are navigating and I wanna talk about careers because this is a big thing, because it's one thing to go to college and to go to the struggles and to go to the learning process. For many first gens, big challenge is getting a job. What did that process look like for you?

Cesar: 16:18

as I got through further along in, in my, the four year, then I didn't wanna be a teacher. I wanted be a counselor.'cause I felt I could make up a bigger difference or a difference in a different way outside of the classroom. So that was my mentality is I wanna be a counselor. But when I graduated, I hadn't done my homework beforehand to look at credential programs, like all these things to set up and apply. So my first job out of graduation with a college degree was actually at Staples. I worked at Staples for a couple months that summer while I was trying to figure it out. And around that time, like towards the end of the summer I came across this posting for. Migrant Head Start, right? And the title of it was called Family Service Advocates. And the description, I'm like, helping kids, helping families in the school system, migrant, it was like checking all these boxes off for me, right? Like that I identify with. So I started that job at the end of the summer and I, I really loved it. I really enjoyed it. About six months later in trying to help one of those families find information about college, I called the university and I spoke with this woman. She came with the information and then she's oh, by the way in a couple of months there's this job opening that's gonna happen. It's working doing outreach, college outreach with junior high and high school students in the local area, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So just think about it. That was like light bulb went off. I'm like perfect. That's what I wanna do, so sure enough I looked for that job posting it opened up, I applied but I got the job, so I started and that was really my path. to where I'm at now is getting that entry level position. I'm not familiar with TRIO programs. This was a educational talent search. It was the first grant that the university had received for that program, and I was one of two initial outreach advisors, counselor, what have you. And I loved it, going to elementary schools, middle schools, high schools, talk about college, talk to fairs, and, yeah, it opened up the whole world and inspired me down the line to go back to school. But initially, like I said, outta grad school, it was, get all stables and while I figured things out,

Miguel Sanchez: 18:42

Share with us what are you doing now and how are you helping first gen?'cause I know you're very involved in the education system.

Cesar: 18:51

I, try and I think. Any role that you're in education, you're always helping others or the reason you get into it is to help others, right? The scale is what differs. You might do it one student at a time, one classroom at a time, one campus at a time. But that job, led me to then eventually get a master's. And, oftentimes it's timing. When I was wrapping up my master's, it was at that same university. A administrative position opened up that I needed a master's for. So

Miguel Sanchez: 19:22

It was

Cesar: 19:23

was in our same department with another TRIO program, student support services. I had the background and the experience working with the populations. So I got the job. So that was my first role in terms of an administrative role. I was still hands-on with students but little more on the on the backend. So then you're looking at, policies, procedures, systems, the things that you can or can't change, right? Something else that, that you're learning. They have to learn. But that was the first role that kind of opened up my eyes in terms of more than just working here, one-on-one.'Cause ever since then, the roles that I've had for the most part

Miguel Sanchez: 19:59

have

Cesar: 20:00

been working in an administrative capacity. With various programs and the scale have of it has grown. One of the first major programs that I worked with was helping create the infrastructure for the Gates Scholarship that launch in 2016. It was, it's still ran by the Hispanic Scholarship Fund, so I was their director of University advocacy. so my role was to create partnerships with universities across the country. And their support services systems, they map out like the student journey and all these different things. But that was really what opened up my experience working nationwide. I. currently. I'm working here in California at the Foundation for California Community Colleges. So the organization has been around about 25 years. And they're very well kept secret'cause I didn't know who they were until I applied. And other people that I talked to that, that come on board, a lot of'em are the same thing. I didn't know this existed until I got here. But. But their role is to help support the chancellor's office at the state level, but also work with districts and community colleges around the state. So the team that I'm on I help oversee some scholarships, grant and disaster relief aid around the state. And again, these are things that I. I'm probably never gonna meet any of the students that benefit from these programs, but the fact that, I play a small part in being able to support these larger initiatives that's what fuels my my passion and the fact that it's with community college students, where we both come from makes it even better.

Miguel Sanchez: 21:34

I often hear students. I wanna go to college, and then immediately after college I wanna go straight into graduate school or law school in our case. I also think there's value in maybe getting a job a field that seems interesting to you. And maybe from there, figure out if that. If it needs more education, maybe they can pursue a graduate degree. Because sometimes I just feel like students are just accelerated, like they're rushing to somewhere. And what I've been seeing is that's only leading to more debt. And so on that note, and from your perspective and your position, what do you think are the biggest challenges for first generation students today?

Cesar: 22:22

Oh God. How much time do we have?

Miguel Sanchez: 22:23

Ah, just

Cesar: 22:26

No. I it's just a few. Yeah, no I think it really depends where you're looking at. If you're looking early on in the career, or I'm sorry, in, in, their schooling. Sometimes it's a lack of preparation, right? That they have to struggle to kinda catch up and all those different things. But where I'm at right now, or to better answer your question is so right now I'm finishing up my doctoral program. I'll finish this year. And my dissertation is looking at the transitional experience of first generation professionals. And the reason I'm looking at that is because when I was working at that with the college students. What I'm starting to see and also from my personal experience and observations is that once students enter the workforce, they didn't like it oftentimes, right? Or it's not what they thought it was. Whether it was the culture of the organizations, companies, what have you. So oftentimes they pivot. I think if you look at the numbers, depending on where you're looking at, 30 to 40% of college grads end up kind of leaving their industry.

Miguel Sanchez: 23:25

So

Cesar: 23:26

that's what's interesting to me now and what I'm hoping to study and find out a little bit more. Or what I find out through the study that can hopefully help inform the four year setting and maybe high school as well, so that students are understanding more about the workplace before they get there so they can mentally, prepare and how to. Acclimate and navigate that process, and obviously not every student, goes through that. But I think again, the percentage that I cited can vary. But that's what ends up happening, right? Is you like me, my, I had a bachelor's degree, I was working at Staples'cause I don't know what else I was gonna do. But oftentimes, even if it's the dream job or because we were good at science, someone told us to be an engineer, right? But then you get there, you know what I don't wanna be in, in a cubicle for eight hours a day. I wanna be out, with people. I had a lot of stories like that as students. So I think the earlier we can have those conversations, get students exposed, they start thinking beyond just the subjects. I might be good at history, I might be good at math. It doesn't necessarily mean you have to be X, right? Because even if you get to that point, you might find out that, you know what, it's not really what I thought it was gonna be. So I think the more we can expose students earlier on and certainly at the four year, that, that likelihood of them succeeding and persevering in their field, especially with all the challenges and struggles, that students go through, will definitely pay off. Because like you said, you take on this whole debt and you got this big old shiny plaque on your wall. But if you're working at a job that's not connected related, and certainly the pay is not there, when are you gonna be able to pay off, those loans. So that's kinda what's interesting to me now. And I have nieces and nephews now, actually one of'em, she's just started San Obispo we've had conversations about grad school, and working and in some fields it's definitely needed, in education. You definitely, for the most part, need at least a master's degree, if not more. And some technical fields, maybe not, right? And some definitely, certifications and you're golden, so it can vary by, by field. But I think the more we start thinking about how you're gonna be able to apply what you're learning, the type of environment you're going into and talk to as many people as possible I think that's probably the biggest win we could have for students.

Miguel Sanchez: 25:53

speaking to people as a way to understand, one of the topics that we like to cover here is mentorships. How was, how would you describe a mentor? do you ask someone to be a mentor? Has somebody come up to you and say, Hey, would you be my mentor? Or have you ever gone to someone and say, Hey, I'm gonna be I'm gonna be your mentor, or can you be my mentee? Like, how does that work? How do you even start that relationship?

Cesar: 26:17

I, it hasn't happened to me, but I have seen people give the same advice. But it, it always feels awkward to me.'cause again I'm, by nature, I'm a very timid person. So I think for me, I. It's more of identifying folks and trying to build a relationship without necessarily making that ask. I, I'm sure if you make that ask, it'll probably be a lot more beneficial. But I think I'm pretty good about. The types of questions that I wonder from them that I wanna know more of. And the reason why. So I think having that, one, what is a mentor, right? It's that guide that can help you avoid pitfalls along the way, right? If you wanna define it in that way and in terms of obtaining, it sometimes it feels kinda like very formal that you have to make that ask, right? But I don't think you do.'cause you might have some people that you might only interact with them, a couple times a year or every other year, a text or a phone call or something, right? But they're always there and there are other people you might see more on a regular basis that you might go to them more frequently for other types of advice. So I think you can have different types of mentors for different things without necessarily having to formally. Identify and say, Hey, you're gonna be my mentor, I'm gonna be your mentee, or can I be your mentee? I think that's another way of going about it as well.

Miguel Sanchez: 27:37

as we come to an end. What would you say is your biggest achievement as a first generation graduate?

Cesar: 27:44

I think the answer is in the question, being a graduate if you look at statistics. Especially for men of color, numbers go down, with every educational sector. So the fact that, like I said, I was very mischievous when I was younger. Not in a bad way, Dennis the menace sort of thing, So the fact that I got through, all the way, and just the other day I was looking at stats for individuals with doctoral degrees. Like in the US about 3% of the population have the doctoral degree. When you look at Latinos, especially Latino men, it's 0.1%. So the fact that I'm like, actually I have my proposal defense later in, in October. So like I can almost see the light at the end of the tunnel. So I think that'll be one of my biggest achievements.

Miguel Sanchez: 28:31

I didn't know how low and I'm shocked, I'm also not surprised. it's important to, to show these numbers and maybe there's a way we can do that better, maybe to this podcast or to other mediums because numbers tell a story and sometimes we say, oh, there aren't a lot. But when you say a percentage, that's less than one. It's really eye-opening.

Cesar: 28:53

And I think, yeah, and I think it's also in, in how we change the narrative, right? Oftentimes when we list someone as a statistic with a negative connotation, right? But depending on the statistic that you're trying to. To site. It could be a good thing. So I think that's also how we can start changing the narrow a little bit, is the types of statistics we use when we use them. Yeah.

Miguel Sanchez: 29:16

great. So is there anything else that you would like to add? Is there anything that you want. Are listeners to hear either advice from your experience, anything that you feel be said.

Cesar: 29:29

For one, thank you for having this platform to amplify the voices. As I said earlier I think the more.

Miguel Sanchez: 29:35

Stories

Cesar: 29:36

we get out there, especially people that come from backgrounds that we came from might look like us. Hopefully some with more hair than I do. But I think seeing those examples that they can do it too. So that's one. And then two I guess two more other things. One is it's never too late to start and make that change be another, and along with that is asking for help because I think, you mentioned it earlier as well, that, had you asked for help at certain stages, things would've been a little bit different. I think as oftentimes we don't allow ourselves because of whatever pride or anything else that say, I gotta get through this on my own. But no, if there's kinda support that you can look at, get it.

Miguel Sanchez: 30:20

thank you very much for being with us today. I appreciate you, your advice and your the information, and I'm sure there will be many of us who are gonna listen to this episode, Elise, more than once. Thank you for being here today.

Cesar: 30:32

Thank you, Miguel.